A bitter dose -jabber(jabber) @拉斯维加斯华人论坛:拉斯维加斯枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of Las Vegas

A bitter dose

jabber(jabber)

If you are employeed now as a Java programmer, it is a good idea for you to take Sun's test. If you want to get some certificates for job hunting, I advise you against taking such exams. Unless you have somem years of Java programming experiences, you have little hope to pass Sun's developer certificate test. Even you have held 3 certificates, you still need to answer various kinds of questions . It seems to me that few companies make a job offer on the basis of some certificates.

I suggest you study Sun's blueprint book, run Sun's pet store demo, investigate Apache's struts, read 50 articles from www.javaworld.com,...
These things are more helpful. Trust me, I am a Java programmer.

Good luck.

(#207185@0)
Last Updated: 2001-9-21
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不是打消你的积极性，3试的难度极大，你要三思！而且可能它的用处不一定比MCSD大（因为有。NET在抄后路呢） -solarisca(IT人); 2001-9-21 (#206789@0)

.Net很多概念也是"borrow from" J2EE,所以也有共同处,也许精通一样就可以 -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-24 (#208791@0)
dot net = don't net. -mocha(Mocha Java); 2001-10-6 (#218209@0)

I AM PREPARING THE EXAMNATIONS NOW -daceasy(DacEasy); 2001-9-21 {223} (#206819@0)

Hi, nice to meet you, I am planning to get a certificate of Java Architect too. I have 2 years exprience in using Java(J2EE) to develop web application. But no agency believes it. Here is a website for Java Certifications.

http://www.jchq.net/

That's great, finally found a person do the same thing with me, hope can commuication with you frequently, so we can exchange the progress of our exam, -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-23 (#208148@0)

sure -daceasy(DacEasy); 2001-9-23 (#208742@0)

A bitter dose -jabber(jabber); 2001-9-21 {721} (#207185@0)

I don't like exam,but... -daceasy(DacEasy); 2001-9-22 {378} (#207441@0)
I have no way to show them my ability. In my opinoin, developing programs is one thing, and taking exam is another. But all my experiences are from china. I think they are nothing here. The goal of getting the certificate is to make Mr. human resource to ask you some questions rather than return your resume and say "I can't help you". Believe me, it's really frustrating.

you are right guy, I totally agree with your point, -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-23 {174} (#208154@0)
if you have this certificate, you have more chance to let Mr. HR talk to you, but of course experience is more important at future, let 's do it better than just think it :D

Let's get started -daceasy(DacEasy); 2001-9-24 {300} (#209027@0)
We should be on the right track. J2EE is a platform with many protocols and techniques. We can read some books on them. As a architect, you should also master some design patterns which are important part of the exam . Of cause we should set up the testing environment and do some projects on them.

yeah, you are right, I have started to prepare the exam, and .. -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-24 {463} (#209558@0)
My idea is using the chance to catch the Architecture design skill, I definitely think it is a important skill at future when we don't have enough energy to learn the new coding language,
I want to give me some pressure to let me study.
now My progress is:
1) Start to learn OO design pattern, base on UML knowledge
2) Try to understand more detail information about J2ee, base on J2ee buleprint.
3) Read some design documents to increase the design skill.

Here is another web site. -daceasy(DacEasy); 2001-9-24 (#209037@0)

thx the URL, get some informations, I 'll also provide some useful URL to you if I found :P -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-24 (#209565@0)

Yes, it is true. From my point of view, If someone has time to obtain a Java certificate, there is a large possibility that she/he is not a real Java developer. My suggestion is: Don't waste you money any more. -usermarco(marco); 2001-9-24 (#208757@0)

I definitely don't want to waste my money, but -daceasy(DacEasy); 2001-9-24 {336} (#209017@0)
you know what, they alway ask me if I am working now when I send them my resume. I always tell them no. Then they would tell me I had to wait and wouldn't ask detail questions anymore. So I think wasting money is better than wasting time. I have many years experience in C/C++ and Java. But they are nothing here. That's the problem.

But the question is: A certificate is really useful to you? -usermarco(marco); 2001-9-24 (#209560@0)

Maybe the certificate can give you one more interview chance, & as I know the Architect certificate don't like MCSD easy to get . -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-24 (#209576@0)

And do you have real-time experience? In Java, are you focus on Swing or server end? JSP or EJB or CORBA? Do you have any knowledge about SNMP and LDAP? -usermarco(marco); 2001-9-24 (#209569@0)

My point is focus on design system, do more architect job is important than just focus on one detail skill . -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-24 (#209579@0)

I don't think so. Experience and details are fundamental for an good system architect. -usermarco(marco); 2001-9-25 (#209606@0)

I agree your point, but I think we should intentionally upgrade our skill to high level, we can't do coding at whole our life right ? -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-25 (#209693@0)

人参果，I am not testing others skill, I just want to know if someone is qualified for an opportunity. actually, most of design patterns are for detail design, not for architecture. -usermarco(marco); 2001-9-25 (#209611@0)

请问考SUN ADMINISTRATOR（I & II）有用么？ -gjh(gjh); 2001-9-23 (#208158@0)

如果是做System Engineer,应该有用, -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-9-23 (#208521@0)

评论：中国IT业将如何应对人才“贫血”？http://www.sina.com.cn -std(std); 2001-9-23 {2453} (#208524@0)

本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.sina.com.cn 2001年09月23日 11:49 中国新闻网

　　中国IT产业每年超过百分之三十的高速增长令世界讶异。然而它面临的挑战也同样严峻。在中国，每年近二十万的人才空缺使其IT产业正处于一个“失血”的境地。

　　中国IT人才告急

　　据一份对北京、上海、广州等全国十大城市的人才需求调查，IT业的人才需求高居榜
首，占到了人才总需求量的百分之四十。而在北京，预计未来五年内这个比例将达百分之五十五。

　　目前国内IT人才培养主要依赖大专院校，但无论数量或质量，其培养出的人才均远不能满足社会需要。

　　数量上，如今中国所有高校里计算机专业的学生只占百分之五，每年向社会输送的学生为七点五万名左右，而目前全国有两千万台电脑，若照此速度，需两百多年才能培养出足够的计算机使用者。

　　另一方面，大学输送的计算机人才离社会需求还有相当距离。IT技术的更新大约需五到六年，而大学里的教材和知识需要十年才能转换一次。大学输送的IT人才充其量只能称作是人才的雏形——人材。

　　职业认证——中国IT人才成长的必由之路

　　“技术+能力”的技能型人才最受到企业的欢迎。在美国的IT企业人才招聘中，百分之七十不看学历而注重人才的技能培训。而国内企业在招聘时，却往往过分注重人才的基础教育框架及从业经验。

　　无论高校或IT企业，他们在技能型人才的培养上均有着无法克服的缺陷。IT企业的培训更侧重于“专题性”，对研发方面的专题技术进行研讨；大学里又往往过于注重基础知识的传授，在IT技术的应用及职业精神的培养上相当欠缺。

　　中国IT教育领域应学会用“两条腿”走路：一方面在正规的高校教学中加入职业认证的内容；另一方面，对IT人才进行全方位的IT职业认证培训和企业IT技能培训。

　　基于此，有人预测说，二十一世纪的中国IT人才市场将迎来一个“考证”时代。求职者出具的各种“IT职业证书”将成为企业评价IT人才的重要依据。

　　中国IT职业认证：路漫漫其修远兮

　　目前中国市场上已有了一些IT技术认证的企业，但多为跨国公司，如Cisco、Oracle、微软等，且都侧重某一品牌，收费高昂。对中国目前的国情来说，其IT培训市场更需要强调技术通用性、内容全面实用以及认证培训体系完整、价格适中。

　　目前中国已开始了这方面的有益的探索。清华万博成为了全国第一个国产品牌的IT职业认证培训机构。

　　但如何从产业高度上为IT人才个人及用人企业提供全套解决方案，如何实现整套的IT培训体系？这仍是一个有待探索的难题，因为它对培训机构的管理层面、应用层面、技术层面和服务层面都提出了很高的要求，如覆盖全国的教学设施、完善的运营管理、全国规模的教务管理体系以及完善的学员服务体系等。

　　而无论如何说，对IT人才职业认证的摸索无疑正在给中国IT业一点一点注入强心剂。中国IT业在“失血”的阵痛中已看到曙光。 (王玲)更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

Another guy will join you! Beliver me, the certificate is definetely something useful. -jasperjaguar(jasperjaguar); 2001-10-6 {294} (#218075@0)

Here is a usefu website http://developer.java.sun.com/developer/restricted/patterns/J2EEPatternsAtAGlance.html
which has all J2EE patterns description.
My suggestion is reading some common Design Patterns first, and then come to J2EE patterns which is a must to test in Java certificate test.

Thanks guy, I 'm appreciate your reply and helping, okay ,LET'S DO IT, -happy_4_7(人参果); 2001-10-8 (#218975@0)

Are there any DX who got job because you has Java certificates? -2eyes1mouth(2eyes1mouth); 2001-10-6 {191} (#218109@0)

I have 1 year Java programming experience (Java Servlet), I took a lot of time to study J2EE. I dont know if Java certificates are useful to find a job as a java developer, if yes, how much?

@Las Vegas

A bitter dose

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